It's necessary and justified but I'm finding myself in a state of near emotional paralysis over having to do this.
The very fact that I've spent over 5 minutes attempting to post the details of this situation, and deleted everything I wrote and re-wrote, is a huge red flag for me. Usually I'm quite verbose and have no problem finding ways to express myself. This one has me tangled up in a big ol knot.
help
-K
The very fact that I've spent over 5 minutes attempting to post the details of this situation, and deleted everything I wrote and re-wrote, is a huge red flag for me. Usually I'm quite verbose and have no problem finding ways to express myself. This one has me tangled up in a big ol knot.
help
-K
posted by:
|
Montana
|
-
Re: I have to fire a good friend...or, she was
Fri, April 11, 2008 - 11:02 PMThank god I have only had to fire one person and he was not an employee but a freelance who worked on projects for me. But I had good coaching, and the best thing I was told was:
- be brief and clear and then stop talking.
The tendency when you're emotionally involved is to talk too much to try to make it better or because you're nervous or whatever, but it's better to be quiet once you've said what you need to say.
I also think if you can soften the blow by not getting personal, or by framing it as a lay off or something it can be easier on both of you because it saves face for her. She may have seen it coming of course, not that that makes it easier.
Also I was once laid off by someone who moaned on afterwards about how stressful it was for her and I just wanted to strangle her! Not that I think you would be that unwise!
-
Re: I have to fire a good friend...or, she was
Sat, April 12, 2008 - 9:44 AMBack in the bad in day when I had a day job as a sales manager for a large company, I had to fire people who were friends away from the office.
I found that if I explained the reason for the firing, and worked out the least painful exit strategy for the employee, it was not only possiblefor our friendship was to last through the termination, but in most cases, it actually became a better friendship after our working relationship (which was sometimes awkward due to performance or job suitability issues) ended.
Ultimately if this is a real friendship...ie, one that would have evolved if you had never worked together, it will be fine. If this was the sort of office friendship based only on working together, then its really not that big of a loss.
Good luck.
-
Re: I have to fire a good friend...or, she was
Sat, April 12, 2008 - 11:43 AMI may be cold hearted, but I have had to do it before... It is a matter of just biting the bullet and doing it.
Phrases I have found helpful are "This isn't working and we need to go our separate ways" "I need to let you go"
Being in construction now actually makes it easier on me:
"Here's your money, get the fuck off my job site and don't come back"
Being a heartless bastard has it's advantages.
JSin
-
-
Re: I have to fire a good friend...or, she was
Sat, April 12, 2008 - 12:34 PMWhen you work with a friend, there is always the possiblity that something like this might happen. Everyone's advice here is good, just be to the point, and dont get the emotional part of it mixed in if you can help it.
-
Re: I have to fire a good friend...or, she was
Sat, April 12, 2008 - 12:46 PMThanks guys.
I've had to fire people before, and even had to fire a good friend once and we're still good friends. This one is different. There are a few facets to this that have me tangled up.
One is that we most likely wouldn't have become friends if not for my hiring her, but the friendship progressed quickly (too quickly actually) and through a series of events I've come to realize she is not the person she initially presented herself to be AT ALL. Without divulging too much personal information let me just say that her behavior is reminiscent of folks with borderline personality disorder and the aspect of this that concerns me the most is her penchant for being vindictive and spiteful when she feels wronged...and she damn near always feels she's being wronged by the world at large.
Of course, she didn't allow me to see this part of her until after I'd already handed her many of the core responsibilities of my business and while she hasn't made any threats or ultimatums toward me yet, I've seen her engage in this tactic in the past month or so with a few others-- and she's also regaled me with many stories from her past where she used this tactic. She seems to be quite proud of this part of her m.o.
Fortunately, I tend to live my life honestly and have nothing to hide or anything she can use against me in a destructive or sabotaging way, but she's quite resourceful and creative when it comes to seeking revenge. At this point I'd really like to have nothing to do with her. Not professionally or personally, as she's become a liability to me on both fronts.
So, I'm thinking that I'll just say, "This just isn't working out the way I'd hoped and I really need someone more reliable and stable to fill this position. Here is your last paycheck and I've already got your shifts covered."
However, I'm fairly certain she'll become defensive and retaliatory...in which case I can just point out that she is validating my point by behaving that way. I do wish her well and have no desire to hurt her or engage in any sort of dramatic conflict...in fact, that's precisely WHY I need her out of my life and my business as she tends to bring a lot of conflict and drama with her everywhere she goes and I just don't have the time, energy or inclination to deal with it any longer.
Anyway, I'll let ya'll know how it goes but I do appreciate everyone's input here.
Thanks.
-K
-
-
Re: I have to fire a good friend...or, she was
Sat, April 12, 2008 - 4:44 PMJust for clarification...is this the same friend you mentioned in another tribe (the rejection thread)? If so - be VERY cautious *how* you go about doing the firing. I've worked in HR and there could be some scary complications (due to the history), if she were to react negatively to the firing.
Protect yourself - you may want to consult an attorney.
-
Re: I have to fire a good friend...or, she was
Sun, April 13, 2008 - 3:52 PMYes, protect yourself. Perhaps another witness when the firing takes place would not be a bad idea, someone neutral and someone who can have your back in case you need someone to back you up later.
Dont say anyting about validating your opinion by any sort of bad behavior on your part. That will just be a "game on" signal to her. Having had to deal with someone with that sort of behavior recently ( BPD ish for sure) I also suggest you read up some, consult an attorney or a counselor friend and ask some advice in how to handle this person in this situation.
COVER YOUR ASS. If she enjoys being vindictive and mean when "wronged", then you best be prepared for some potential fucked up ness coming your way.. these people are completely black and white in many ways and see no greys and aren't wired to even understand the concept of grey. You are either against them or for them.
-
-
Re: I have to fire a good friend...or, she was
Sun, April 13, 2008 - 4:22 PMThanks Elaine. You *get* it.
I've decided to write her up formally and basically offer her what will either become more rope to hang herself with or a chance to step up to the plate and stop fucking around on my time (and money and energy). This is my way of covering my ass. She's already signed a contract that she neglected to follow through on and put my entire business in jeopardy in doing so, so a third person to bear witness to this contract addendum is a fabulous idea.
Thus far her infractions have been:
*Improperly preparing, packaging and labeling the food she made in her own home without consent.
*having someone else deliver the food she made from home resulting in client’s getting the wrong meals (This one is HUGE and could've cost me a liability suit!!!!!)
*Cooking from her home even after we discussed that she wouldn’t do that ever again due to health and safety issues. (Though she first tried to lie about it, then once she admitted it it became a victimizing situation..."But you know I'm not allowed to drive right now"...which was something I didn't discover until after weeks after I'd hired her)
*Showing up much later than she said and consistently requesting to leave early due to her personal problems.
*Arriving at work improperly attired for food safety handling (flip flops and hair not tied up)
*Consistently combining her personal purchases with the company purchases despite being asked repeatedly not to do that, and expecting to be compensated for both.
*Not following up with clients, i.e. failing to call them back when requested.
So, perhaps the best course of action I can take for both of us would be to lay out a set of VERY clear and concise boundaries and expectations. If she fucks up, then I can simply refer her back to the contract and any deviation from the contract would be grounds for immediate dismissal.
-K
-
-
Re: I have to fire a good friend...or, she was
Sun, April 13, 2008 - 5:55 PMYou know, those points right there are grounds enough for immediate dismissal in any place of business. The health code issues alone could ruin you financially right there.
Write it down, Document everything. Have someone authoriative and third person with you when you fire her.
If you are worried about how to do this, just think of how much money this chick is costing you and could cost you and how would you deal with this if she wasn't your freind? Cause, she IS NOT your friend. She is your manipulating, lying, dishonest, neglectful soon to be ex employee.
I dont know all that much about this particular disorder, other than I seem to have run into several people who suffer from it lately... Unforntunately, its all been with the dark sides of this thing.. She may not have BPD, but there is a whole gamut of anti societical personality disorders out there, and it can be really hard to deal with for everyone involved.
Bu tthat is neither here nor there at the end of it., she is a problem employeee and she got to go. -
-
Re: I have to fire a good friend...or, she was
Sun, April 13, 2008 - 7:59 PMIt is also important to be very careful about what is stated in a public forum relating to any matter which might become legally complicated down the road. I have a friend who, at this very moment, is fighting a million dollar defamation suit related to a "rant" she posted on craigslist airing some verifiable grievances about another person. The post was only up for a few hours but is having some long term financial repercussions for her even if she wins the case. -
-
Re: I have to fire a good friend...or, she was
Sun, April 13, 2008 - 8:20 PMI appreciate you looking out for me, *B*. I really do. Thank you.
As I stated before, I have nothing to hide and nothing to hide from. I come here for a sounding board and there's not a single thing I;ve said that isn't a-) true, and b-) been expressed directly to my employee (albeit through voice messages thus far as she hasn't called me back and I'm wary of putting this in writing due to potential legalities).
-K -
-
Re: I have to fire a good friend...or, she was
Sun, April 13, 2008 - 8:37 PM"I come here for a sounding board"
...which is all I was offering. Certainly not criticizing anything you've done or need to do.
-
-
-
-
Re: I have to fire a good friend...or, she was
Sun, April 13, 2008 - 9:59 PMK, all you really have to do is tell her is that you won't be requiring her services any longer - there's no reason to get into a discussion about details. Hand her her check and ask her to leave, but give her a few minutes (supervised) to collect her belongings. The idea of a witness being present is a very good one. In the unlikely event that she goes bananas on you (I once had this happen) - just call 911 and have her escorted out. It's never easy - at least for me. Fortunately, it doesn't happen all that often. -
-
Re: I have to fire a good friend...or, she was
Mon, April 14, 2008 - 12:46 AMMan, I was in a situation with someone like this. If she felt I hurt her, she would act retaliatory.
I found it bizarre since it was a new one on me with a close friend.
I brought it to her attention, I mentioned that that behavior hurt me, I tried to reason, I tried to just lay my feelings out and each time I was retaliated against.
After about 5 of these experiences/attempts, I cut off all ties. I'm so glad I was in a position to do so.
I realized that there was no reasoning.
Your situation sounds familiar.
If I found myself in this position again, I would say absolutely nothing about their behavior. I would remain as neutral as possible in my dismissing them. It would be clean, with as few words as possible and as soon as possible. With this kind of personality, you gotta be careful. I call it 'Poking the Bear'. To name any faults on her part is just poking the bear.
-
-
Re: I have to fire a good friend...or, she was
Thu, May 8, 2008 - 5:04 PMIf she is fucking around with your money*as you stated* and violated the contract, than it is time to fire her immediately.
A person knowing they are on the edge of being fired and not having a conscience about wasting your money usually ends up giving you a life lesson by ripping you off or screwing with your clients to pay you back.
Betcha......
shouldn't waste anymore time on her.
-
-
-
-
