I work with one. He is WAY into it.

Someone in this tribe is one, I think. Was it Bloke? I can't remember now but it came up in a conversation in here ages ago.

Not sure if this will help...

www.oelodge.uklinux.net/history.htm

And, yes, Bloke is a Freemason (and a lovely man) so he might be able to answer some questions (but he may have to kill you if he does! ;-)

Fifi < Bloke is a Freemason (and a lovely man) so he might be able to answer some questions >

Awww shucks :)

quel qu'un < Does anyone know much about them?>

I will see if I can help :)

On the Society itself, Wikipedia as a reasonable article (when it is not being vandalised) at en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freemasonry

But it is the ‘separation’ thing which is probably where I can help most....

It is a simple question with a complex answer., which I will try to make comprehensive without writing a book.

I am a Freemason, member under The Grand Lodge of Ancient Free and Accepted Masons of Victoria (Australia).

I hold the rank of ‘Master Mason’, and am currently second from the top position of my lodge. That also makes me a member of the Grand Lodge which is the peak body which governs lodges in the State of Victoria, Australia. Indeed I have been elected to lead my lodge as of this month. I am also the editor of a Monthly Masonic Newsletter, and read widely on Freemasonry. Having said all that, I would not regard myself as an expert in this question of Masonic ‘separation’ in America– but can answer it off the cuff..

“Freemason” is a very diverse term. Let’s keep that in mind. Let’s also keep in mind that there are ‘regular’ Freemasons, who meet with the blessing of their respective peak bodies, a Grand Lodge which will often be recognised as legitimate by other Grand Lodges. There is also ‘irregular’ Freemasons who may or may not, work under a Grand Lodge, but who will generally not be recognised by other Grand Lodges and hence not be able to visit lodges meeting in, or under, other jurisdictions (even when in the same city). This creates ‘seperation’ purly based on membership of respective Grand Lodges. It also creates inclusiveness between the members of Sister Grand Lodges..

<Back in the 70's, before when he passed, the black members were separate from the whites>

I note you are from California and assume you make a comment about freemasonry there – in many States of American they were separate.. Grand Lodge California removed the rule which perpetuated this separation in 1994

However, more generally, the explanation (but no justification) on ‘black members were separate from the whites’ will vary, and many not even apply – there is no separation.. ...

Here in Australia – there is not, nor ever were, such Lodges. The necessity of such a lodge because of prejudice would be viewed as ‘unmasonic’ (whatever that means, it is often debated). Nor am I aware of any in Europe, with one exception, but that is not along American lines and information on it is sketchy, and it was not about racism – it was, as every lodge is, a group of men wanting to meet together, and they just happened not to be white. I would love to visit them !

A core value of Freemasonry is equality, and respect of others – their religious and political beliefs, and the idea we are all part of a ‘brotherhood of man’ regardless of race, creed or social and economic standing. Hence Regular Freemasonry is generally (as should be) a diverse group of men. In my lodge we have men of diverse ethnic backgrounds and faiths, “Democrats’ and “Republicans” (using the American terms) etc, poor and wealthy etc etc. It is not supposed to matter.

(oh – and in anticipation of questions and comments, regular Freemasons Lodges only admit men as members, This is rooted in the historical and obsolete lower social standing of woman, but continues because, pad it how one might, what is called ‘regular freemasonry’ ; ‘Ancient Free and Accepted Freemasonry ‘ is a *men’s* organisation. I have spoken about that in EH here extremehonesty.tribe.net/threa...86ee4d Having said that, there are also women only Lodges, and mixed lodges – but the Grand Lodge I work under does not extend recognition to such bodies... but for the record, we do recognise many of those Freemasons who choose to meet at “Black’ Lodges (referring loosely to the colour of their skin), but in Freemasonry “Black Lodges’ is also a term used to describe Lodges not working under a recognised Grand Lodge..) Something to keep in mind because you might see internet articles condemning and advocating “Black Lodges’ but these are discussing ‘irregular’ lodges not meeting under a Grand Lodge – nothing to do with skin colour.

To expand on your comment, we need to look at history.

Firstly, you are right, there was (and sadly is) separation in North America. It is being eliminated.

In Nth America, there are Grand Lodges that were formed by African Americans. These are generally referred to as “Prince Hall Grand Lodges” working “Prince Hall Freemasonry” and their creation is rooted in history and racial prejudice of Nth American White Freemasons. Shameful, but let’s extend some understanding of time and place and the society from which they were born. Let’s not condemn our Masonic forbears as we well might – only those who wish to perpetuate their wrongs....

Firstly, what is a Lodge a Grand Lodge ?

A Lodge is not a place, nor building, it is a collective noun for a group of Freemasons. Traditionally, groups of Lodges have formed peak bodies called “Grand Lodges”. The first such Modern Grand Lodge was born in a pub in 1717 in England. The roots of Freemasonry predates 1717, but are disputed, And for our conversation here, let’s just say irrelevant and Modern Freemasonry was born in England in 1717.

Grand Lodges generally cover a geographic area – often States, sometimes a whole country. I am not aware of an American State which does not have at least one Grand Lodge.

Each Lodge has something called a “warrant’ issued by a Modern Grand Lodge– a license to meet (prior to 1717 speculative Freemasons would not worry about such a thing).. Military lodges have ‘traveling warrants” (the Irish thought those up) and instead of meeting at a specific time or place, they traveled with a military unit or regiment and met where the masons happened to be, whether on Ship, in China, Australia or Nth America... “traveling warrants’ have evolved somewhat, but let’s stick to a generalized history..

Firstly, let’s acknowledge there was very wide spread institutionalized racism in society, and most American Grand Lodges were also had institutionalize racism. . However, the idea Eighteenth Century Freemasons in America would never make a ‘black’ man a Freemason is wrong. Prince Hall Freemasonry was born because that very thing happened.

Straight from Wikipedia (that generally has good articles on Freemasonry– when they are not being vandalised).

“On March 6, 1775, an African American named Prince Hall was made a Master Mason in Irish Constitution Military Lodge No. 441, along with fourteen other African Americans: Cyrus Johnston, Bueston Slinger, Prince Rees, John Canton, Peter Freeman, Benjamin Tiler, Duff Ruform, Thomas Santerson, Prince Rayden, Cato Speain, Boston Smith, Peter Best, Forten Horward, and Richard Titley, all of whom apparently were free by birth. When the Military Lodge left the area, the African Americans were given the authority to meet as a Lodge, form Processions on the days of the Saints John, and conduct Masonic funerals, but not to confer degrees nor to do other Masonic work. These individuals applied for and obtained a Warrant for Charter from the Grand Lodge of England in 1784 and formed African Lodge #459.

Despite being stricken from the rolls (like all American Grand Lodges were after the 1813 merger of the Antients and the Moderns), the Lodge restyled itself as African Lodge #1 (not to be confused with the various Grand Lodges on the Continent of Africa), and separated itself from United Grand Lodge of England-recognized Masonry. This led to a tradition of separate, predominantly African American jurisdictions in North America, which are known collectively as Prince Hall Freemasonry. Widespread racism and segregation in North America made it impossible for African Americans to join many mainstream lodges, and many mainstream Grand Lodges in North America refused to recognize as legitimate the Prince Hall Lodges and Prince Hall Masons in their territory.“

So, as far as we know, in 1775, Nth America has 15 African Americas who has been made Freemasons in the Colony.

Simply, these men were not accepted by their white “brothers”, and the short story is they said ‘bugger you !” and formed their own Grand Lodge. Well done Brothers !

The problem with this is that, in order to be able to visit other lodges, you need to be made a mason in a Regular Sister Constitution – so this cut many African Americans out of that system.

Furthermore, there is a strong tradition of recognising only one Grand Lodge in a geographic location (although lodges often worked in the one city under a “Provincial Grand Lodge” or simply warrants for single lodges issued by several Sister Grand Lodges. Here in Melbourne in the 1800’s you had lodges working under three Grand Lodges, the Irish, Scottish and English – but as each Grand Lodge recognised the other – these masons could all visit and had their status as masons recognised in the lodges meeting under Sister Constitutions.

Our African American Brothers faced the problem that they were excluded from American white “freemasonry” by prejudice. Now, each Grand Lodge is a Sovereign Body, answerable only to itself, so they formed their own. Good idea. The problem was that other Grand Lodges of other Jurisdictions would not recognise them. Sometimes because there was another Grand Lodge in existence, but also because of Prejudice.

So African Americans ended up with Prince Hall Grand Lodges in many states of American, recognising each other, but being regarded as ‘irregular.”.

Back to the core values of Freemasonry, a product of the Enlightenment, this clearly contradicts the idea of men being equal and sharing a common brotherhood.

But most just accepted, or at least did nothing to change, this contradiction to our core values – on both sides. But it is changing “According to data compiled in 2008, 41 out of the 51 mainstream US Grand Lodges recognize Prince Hall Grand Lodges.” Source freemasonry.bcy.ca/prince_hall/

So American Freemasons are reversing the wrong of allowing racism to shape our organisation.

Details on current status of recognition bessel.org/masrec/phachart.htm & map bessel.org/masrec/phamapshistorical.htm


CA Prince Hall Grand Lodge www.mwphglcal.org/ph/
CA Grand Lodge www.freemason.org/ and nice to see them promote their Prince Hall Brothers www.freemason.org/resources..._links.php

< I don't know what they do now, but I remember his funeral was really frightening. >

What did they do ?

i'm in the military and I know many guys who refer to the "black masons" with a lot of spite. The military is supposed to be the ultimate equal ground but many claim that has changed over the years. I've only seen the symbol on high ranking enlisted men's vehicles as long as I can remember, in the army.

In fact, its the only contact I've had with the masons as far as I know, but I'm sure it ranges further...as far as how it affects my life and all the social and economic circles I've been a part of.