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Its a long standing policy here that deleting threads that have been commented in by others is not cool. If you post a thread you may delete it before someone responds. After there are responses deleting a thread including work by others will resulted in your removal from the tribe.
Rona since you might not have been aware of this I'll let it slide, but stop deleting threads you start.
Rona since you might not have been aware of this I'll let it slide, but stop deleting threads you start.
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Portland
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Re: Deleting threads
Thu, July 30, 2009 - 7:24 PMThank you for this policy. It's called Extreme Honesty. So if we have the courage to write what we really think, why worry about someone you don't want to read might read it? Is this why Rona delete that thread? I thought it was very helpful and I know a number of people also wrote that they experienced the same shit---lying cheating bf/gf and couldn't completely cut ties. I believe it doesn't matter what some people say, there are always going to be people who like what you say and people who don't like what you say. You can't please everyone (I don't really care to anyways) so might as well just be extremely honest--be ourselves.
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Re: Deleting threads
Tue, November 3, 2009 - 2:02 AMthanks Rich - and everyone else
sorry about that. won't happen again.
Honesty is where it's at -
Lies? - diminish us all - I truly feel sorry for people who feel that Lies give them power over others - when will they learn that it only damages them?
peace -
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Re: Deleting threads
Tue, November 3, 2009 - 6:19 AMActually, lies can damage other people, they don't only damage the people who tell them. If they did, it lying wouldn't be such a big deal since it wouldn't effect anyone other than the liar. Also, lies don't always damage the people telling them. People lie because it *does* give them power of some kind or access to something they want. People buy into the lies told to them because it gives them at least the illusion of power of some kind and they believe it will give them access to something they want. Both the liar and the person lied to dance together (if we're talking about adults here). I've found it's best to focus on our own integrity and honesty first rather than making it all about other people and assuming we're always honest and acting with integrity ourselves. I've found that I generally only buy into or fail to recognize a lie - get conned - if I'm lying to myself or being unrealistic. These aren't always obvious lies, often just things I'd like to believe about myself or someone else that aren't totally accurate or realistic. Sure some people are just very naive or gullible, that's still being out of touch with reality. It's good to be able to distinguish between fantasy and reality - nothing wrong with fantasy and fiction in and of itself, it's just not actually reality. (Though really good fiction *can* reveal things about reality that may not be immediately obvious.) And, if one can take a compassionate perspective, a lot of people lie to protect themselves in some way or out of fear. -
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Re: Deleting threads
Tue, November 3, 2009 - 9:54 AMYou are absolutely right -
I've been lied to in a way I've never experienced before - someone I believed in, cared about, and in fact, loved - for over a year and a half completely painted a false picture of themselves - then would accuse me of not knowing them for who they really are.
I've been affected deeply by this - and I now believe that THIS is what they've been feeding on. the lying, cheating, compartmentalization of their lives with no transparency - the anger and upset when I'd simply ask why things were out of place with their story, or stories told that weren't adding up, etc...
Finally - the lies are revealed, I'm hurt - and it's over - I'm free from them and the psychological bondage I've endured - -
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Re: Deleting threads
Tue, November 3, 2009 - 10:15 AMThere are nut jobs everywhere who cannot accept themselves for who they are. In time you begin to be able to spot them very readily. When I was in my teens I dated a girl who was exactly as you describe. Since that time I am quite careful when things don't seem to quite add up. While it has happened a few times it generally has kept me out of trouble.
Some red flags I use
1. It is never their fault
2. There are folks out to get them for real or imagined slights.
3. drama.... If they seem to feed on it there is something up.
4. Any deception... This includes gifts and the like. Rather than telling me even a white lie simply tell me you can't talk about it or won't talk about it
If they flag on even one of these the likelihood of a relationship occurring becomes equitable to the chance of a snowball surviving the summer in hell.
JSin -
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Re: Deleting threads
Tue, November 3, 2009 - 10:56 AMJSin - "Some red flags I use 1. It is never their fault"
Good pointers. Relationships involve two people so both parties bear some level of responsibility.
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Re: Deleting threads
Tue, November 3, 2009 - 10:17 AMRona - Have you looked at why you bought into the lies? What lies you were telling yourself that made you not recognize you were being lied to? I understand that you believe you loved this person but clearly you didn't love them but rather the image they were trying to create or you'd created that wasn't the reality of who they are. I'd suggest that if you want to avoid being in this kind of relationship/situation again that you look at your own part in it and where you were dishonest with yourself or willing to be conned (none of this makes you a bad person, we all need to live to learn and make mistakes). We always play some part in our own deception (this doesn't discount the hurtfulness of someone else's lack of integrity or their responsibility for their actions, it's just taking responsibility for whatever we contributed ourselves...it really does take two to tango :-) -
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Re: Deleting threads
Tue, November 3, 2009 - 2:13 PMYou're so right (2 to tango)
I look at my part often - and am trying to forgive myself for losing my dignity, self respect and power.
thanks for your input - love the red flags also - I just didn't head them when I started to notice this inconsistencies in their story's - hope, sometimes, isn't enough. -
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Re: Deleting threads
Tue, November 3, 2009 - 5:54 PMRona - We all make mistakes, it's how we learn. So you don't like how you acted or look to yourself in retrospect? The way I see it, it's not about forgiveness, it's about accepting those parts of yourself and moving on (and getting help if you need it or feel you need to change an internal dynamic). So you were human? Big deal. People get into shitty relationships all the time, understand why you chose to do so this particular time, check to see if it's a pattern, and make some new rules about relationships for yourself.
Hope sounds like it may have been the source of your problems...hoping for something despite the reality can lead to a state of denial and living in a fantasy that's bound to be ruptured by reality. This is what I mean by we get caught up in the lies we're telling ourselves or fantasies we've created. Hope is never enough when it comes to relationships and often what's hoped for is more of a fantasy than a reality in the first place. Sounds like the other person may have been right when they said you didn't see them for who they were! Instead of beating yourself up over not heading the warning signs your partner was giving you (or the passive exit they were trying to make), why not look at what you got from not heading those signs and choosing hope/fantasy instead of reality? I suspect this is where your central lie to yourself resides. Nobody can live up to a fantasy and when we want something unreal we're likely to choose people who are pretenders. Pick up your dignity, self respect and power of the floor - fantasies are bound to fail, that's the nature of fantasy. If you recognize that, you can enjoy fantasy and imagination without it overtaking real life and real people. -
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Re: Deleting threads
Wed, November 4, 2009 - 10:06 AMThanks for your input -
her actions get much darker in the realm of lies, the use of witchcraft to get things (people) control, but since some of my tribe friends know her -I'm gonna take the gentlemans route here.
I may have already said too much - but tribe has been the only place where I can actually talk about it (unfortunately) I dont' have the guy or girl friends who will just let me talk, share, release it, and move on - especially the way she chose to end our communication this past weekend.
I'm worth far more and am moving forward now.
Love and Light... -
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Re: Deleting threads
Wed, November 4, 2009 - 12:19 PMand after all that's been said between the deleted threads and this one - we get this:
>>her actions get....<<
>>specially the way she chose to end our communication this past weekend.<<
Rona,
i think you are exactly where you want to be.
and have been.
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This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.
Re: Deleting threads
Wed, November 4, 2009 - 1:17 PMThe use of witchcraft?
Seriously?
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Re: Deleting threads
Wed, November 4, 2009 - 3:05 PMYes, Elaine, when the hula hoop fails, witchcraft is now the recommended course of action.
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Re: Deleting threads
Wed, November 4, 2009 - 1:18 PMRona - I have to agree with Wild on this one. And I'd add that it doesn't sound like you're being honest with yourself or us. You're actually coming off as quite "dark" and manipulative yourself, but that's often what happens when we're not being honest with ourselves and simply projecting onto others. Hope you find a way to deal with this that doesn't involve trying to engage others in a dishonest way and that serves your higher good, and that values all involved and allows you to move forward in a compassionate way. -
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This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.
Re: Deleting threads
Wed, November 4, 2009 - 8:08 PMthanks for the input -
I guess I came here cause I wanted to check in about it (plus she's been reading some of my other posts and I'm feeling a little stalked)
But I came back and I guess secretly wanted a sounding board about how I'm feeling in not getting some needs met, mainly communication and honesty (when their words are opposite of their actions) and dealing with blameful self expression and defensiveness when certain questions are asked. ex: (is there someone else in your life?).
For me - if someone wants the truth - and I'll give it - I just ask them if they really wanna know before they ask - then I'm an open book. This is something I want to have from someone I'm in a relationship with (which to me is far deeper than just "dating") not to mention friends.
so if I ask something and I get yelled at for asking, their walls go up, they need space, makes me wonder - and wonder, and wonder. Not wanting to falsely accuse on one hand - but not living a lie on the other - when your gut is yelling at you about something that's just not right. Ya know?
You have a question - especially surrounding why they said one thing ( "I don't wanna party. those days are over for me") then at some party they're coming out of the bathroom with the bartender - (who notices you and of course invites you to do some after she leaves to make up for it - (I was up front about wanting to party - but she wanted me to stop - and I did - until that night)
when you ask later that night - or the next day and they get upset, defensive and blameful toward you. What's going on there? Are they a liar - telling you "I'm not a liar and a cheater" and "you don't see me for who I really am" - this baffles me. If your words and actions are the same - I've got no problem. If not - I'm coming wanting to communicate about it, and when that shuts down due to not wanting to be clear about it from them - it sucks - that's been the biggest issue for me..and someone saying "you don't see me for who I really am" but their walk and talk aren't the same? WTF? I got to the point that were whatever they said - meant the opposite (and that didn't work for long either) but I hung in there - why? I ask ....(ok..I really love this girl and wanted to work through it instead of leaving and missing the chance at a deeper more meaningful connection with her)
So I hope that's clear - talking about shit - not finding some jar with your name on it in the frig, or other things "out of place" that make you wonder what's really going on- anyway..that's my rant and I'm stickin to it.
Thanks for all your input, observations and even just spending the time reading this - your responses show that I'm not the only one who feels strongly about such things.
just a guy having a hard time with never really knowing someone I still love - but just wouldn't let him in anymore - different communication styles I guess.
peace
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Re: Deleting threads
Wed, November 4, 2009 - 8:45 PMWitchcraft? Really?!? Do you REALLY think that's the case? I under stand Tribe being a "safe place", but if you know anything about *actual* witchcraft, you'd know you were talking out of your ass. Manipulation and passive-aggression have *nothing* to do with witchcraft, and using your Powers for evil, well, even if I knew an active witch that cold control the Universe so blatantly and directly as it sounds like you believe, it's always responded with by three-fold, if not ten-fold, power, which is reason enough to not be a right bitch. If she convinced you she's a witch, I'm sorry, because I don't believe that's the case. Dark is dark. Take good care of yourself!!! -
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This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.
Re: Deleting threads
Wed, November 4, 2009 - 9:59 PMI'm not saying she's a witch - she just goes to this lady with her needs - who then gives her candles to burn for various reasons (to meet her soulmate, whatever) and once time I found a jar in the fridge with my and her name on it on seperate sides of the jar...
anyway - we're done now with no resolve - it sucks - and I've gotta move on with my life...thanks -
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Re: Deleting threads
Thu, November 5, 2009 - 11:52 AMgonna sign off - nothing personal - just noticed she's now on this tribe..and I need space and time to heal during the break up.. love and light to you all... -
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Re: Deleting threads
Wed, November 18, 2009 - 8:48 PMTake good care of yourself, sweetie!
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